I've just purchased a load of Enfield Robin stuff

[brucey]

Hello everybody!

As the subject title says (and it's probably been dicussed on this forum somewhere), I purchased enough coversion bits to build approximately 5 Diesel Enfields.
I haven't been through everything yet but I am keen to maintain the high standards that Ernie Dorsett set.
I have read the reviews and seen the you tube clips. I am under no illusion this will not be a performance machine but that's not my priority. I want to travel from A to B in the cheapest way possible. Some friends and I did a 500 mile camping holiday on Honda 125's a few years back and we had a ball!
I'm a 54 year old Design Engineer. I did a Toolmaking Apprentiship many years ago and do various projects in my well equipped workshop at the bottom of the garden. This includes building Soap Box Racers and a couple of Pre 65 Trials Triumph Tiger Cubs which I ride at club level. I also ride a BMW 650 Dakar on the road.
I will now start looking for a 350 Enfield Bullet to convert. I'm tempted to go down the trials route as I prefer this style of bike.
That's about it for now. I hope to speak to you guys a lot more in the future as your collective experience is invaluable.

brucey

[coachgeo]

Welcome to the board. We did discuss this sale in I believe the classifieds.

Hope your willing to help out diesel enfield folk for many years to come!!!!

[brucey]

Coachgeo,

Thanks for your welcome. I've just come back from celebrating my 30th wedding anniversary in New York and have been to the USA several times on business.
I found the thread last night and agree with what was said. I have bought these parts with my eyes open and am aware that obtaining Robin DY41 and DY42 engines (not quite sure what the differences are yet) may become a problem. I have details of 2 off engines in the UK. The guy who sold the parts said a lot of the engines went to the USA Army to power pumps. I work for Hitachi in the UK looking after high speed trains and may call in a couple of favours from Japanese contacts!
I am treating this as purely a learning experience and hobby. I have acquired a lot of build records, publicity articles, conversion parts, assemblies and welding jigs. I'm just beginning to go through everything! If I can help anyone please let me know.

brucey

[pietenpol2002]

Wecome to the forum Brucey. Great to hear you've taken on the challenge of perpetuating Ernie's endeavor. And that you're doing it with your eyes wide open. Undoubtedly, not a get-rich-quick scheme. But, perhaps a fulfilling one nonetheless.
I am curious as to the reported dielemma of securing the Robin engines in the UK. I notice that Robin doesn't have a distributor of the diesel engines in the UK, but they appear to be readily avialable elsewhere in the EU. Quite a number of distributors in Germany. And they're certainly avialable here in the states including one here in my home state. Is it a matter of restricted distribution by Robin? Or an import ban? Or does Suburu/Fuji plan to discontinue production?
BTW, it would appear Midland Power Distributors UK Limited carries them. Unless it's an outdated website.
Best of luck with the endeavor and do keep us posted on your work.

[brucey]

Cheers Pietenpol2002,
More response from America than the UK!
I checked the Midland Power Distributors web site and will drop them an e mail tomorrow. They seem to do spares but I haven't seen a complete Robin DY41 on their site.
My 24 year old Son has been around and was amazed diesel bikes even existed! He was very impressed with the publicity info I was given on the 'Yellow Peril' which was unfortunately destroyed in a fire at the National Motorcycle Museum. Maybe I should build a replica with the bits I have? Does anyone have any good quality photos of this bike?

brucey

[Stuart]

Welcome Brucey The best shot of that bike I have is on our page dedicated to Ernie and his motorcycles.
http://www.dieselbike.net/Dorsett/Dorsett.htm
Tony Dymott knows a fair bit about this engine and is an old friend of Ernie's. I shall alert him to your endeavour!

Stuart

[brucey]

Stuart,

Many thanks. I found that photo. A high res photo and the exact colour (looks like 'safety yellow) would be nice. I printed it along with Ernie's Trials Diesel Enfield (as I have a particular interest in trials irons). These will hang on my wall as inspiration when things get tough!

Any advise/info on the Fuji DY41 and DY42 engines would be great. Especially the difference between the 2. It looks like a DY42 has a different air cleaner.

I just need to locate an Enfield 'Doner' bike to get started.

Brucey

[gilburton]

There are no real physical differences the main one is capacity. The DY 41 is around 8.5 HP and the DY42 around 10hp.Check the spares list for differences.
The UK importer used to be Redbreast engineering of Brixworth Northants but they are no longer there.
I believe these engines are now discontinued.
On my(now sold) MZ Robin I was seriously considering changing the engine to a Chinese clone as spares for the robin were difficult to come by

[gilburton]

http://www.wedophones.com/Manuals/Subar ... Manual.pdf

http://www.jackssmallengines.com/pdf_do ... P5769A.pdf

http://www.goscor-power-products.co.za/ ... Manual.pdf
Hope these help?
In my opinion if you are just making a bike for yourself if you can find a Robin engine make sure it is all there and is in good condition. If you can buy a joblot of spares get them!! Maybe you have contacts in plant machinery etc.??
I don't know what my engine came from but it had a starting handle spigot so I assume a pump or generator??
A pull starter and electric start is preferable!!
They still turn up on ebay but sometimes they can be bought as a generator or some other equipment.
I don't know how the 2 compare but I found the DY41 was ok for 50/55 mph.
Some parts from the DY35 will fit but avoid this engine if possible.
The problem is these engines have the flywheel on the left giving the engine an "unbalanced" look in the frame.
Once again in my opinion if you are considering making more than one with the spares you have available have a look at the Chinese Yanmar clones as you can buy these for around £400 new!! and it might be worth adapting/re engineering your parts to fit??
All the best with your project

[brucey]

Gilburton,

Many thanks for the information. I have a lead on 2 new DY42's but they are twice the price of the Yanmar engines advertised on the Price Parts website!
I have enough bits to build around 5 Robin DY 41/42 based bikes (including chromed inlet manifolds, exhausts, heat shields etc.) So it would be a shame to waste them.
I think if I was going to change the engine type, I would consider a twin. We have a cracking little twin cylinder, water cooled diesel engine in our Cherry Picker at work!

Brucey

[gilburton]

That's because they are Yanmar clones. The genuine Yanmar would be equally expensive! Check out how cheap the Chinese engine parts are on ebay though!
What about one of these clones? The original Ruggerini has been fitted to the Enfield.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/20Hp-L290-LAU ... 53ed66c4a3

[Stuart]

If you look hard enough I'm sure the engines will turn up eventually. Trying other engines now will only put the cost up & the clones don't last very long.
Ernie only sent me paper pictures of his bikes bless him, so can't improve on the images I'm afraid.
Kicking the Robin over is quite an art if I remember correctly. Use your full weight for the complete 180 degrees. Crash the kick start against the end stop and it may, may mind you, just have enough momentum to fire it up

[gilburton]

Bit expensive but looks in good condition. You could always sell the rest on??
Not electric start though!!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sellarc-Diese ... 3f29e89786

[brucey]

Stuart,
I got a fairly good photo from this wesite. I'm assuming the 'Yellow Peril' was kick start only then! Having looked at a few you tube clips, I'm definately going for electric start!


Gilburton,
I never thought about looking for the end product! many thanks. So that will give me more items to search for on e bay!

I've e mailed Midland Power but I think their DY42's are recoil start. I'm not sure how practical/cost efective it would be to convert these to electric start.

I'm in no great rush so I'll just take my time and see what turns up.

[gilburton]

You get to be a bit of an expert on looking for Robin engines on ebay.
I used to look at least once a week in the business office and industrial category.
Sometimes they're not advertised as Robin so look out for the greenish blue fuel tank on machinery,generators etc.

[tonyd]

Brucey,

Well done on your purchase, I did think about it for a while.
I have A Dorsett Matchless diesel. Used regularly but currently in the workshop with cycle part repairs and a touch of paintwork.

There were some mods to the Robin engine. The flywheel has been machined down as has the flywheel casing. The standard alternator produces too little power if you want to run lights. I think mine has a Robin item of about 180 watts which allows good lighting at both ends and running tail lights on my trailer.
I do have an engine I bought from ebay that runs but it is not a DY42 as the fixing holes on the base are closer than mine so I was patient and eventually found a replacement DY42. This begs the question of course- why did I need a replacement? Well it blew up in a big way putting the rod through the cases and wrecking them, the piston, the barrel. At the time it was inexplicable and very worrying. I was riding from Scotland to Hampshire with a fully loaded bike and trailer. The bikes performance had been down for a while but it was gradual and I realised now I had on this long trip I was pretty well full throttle all the time. ( The engine is rated at 8.5bhp continuous and 9.5 peak) Much later I discovered a partially blocked injector, this was successfully cleared with a neat injector cleaner that actually replaced the diesel.
Finding an electric start DY42 is not easy but if you find a source I would be interested in a spare engine. I do think that these engines when secondhand are not always looked after. I have seen blocked fuel filters due to contaminated fuel and one engine with the filter missing completely.
Ernie said that they could not be kickstarted and he blanked off the kickstarter on mine. Pull starting is possible but the mechanism sticks out and is not pretty.
I do agree that Ernie did a great job in retaining an original gearbox and primary drive on my matchless and the usual comment is "I never realised Matchless made a diesel" so that I feel is the ultimate compliment to what he created.
I am on the Isle of Wight, happy to chat or maybe hook up somewhere.

Tony

[tonyd]

Forgot to say- I am very cynical of clone engines and whatever you do try and get to the Diesel rally next summer. Really good fun and some really nice people.

Thanks Stuart eversomuch for your organisation of this event.

[brucey]

Tonyd,

Thanks for the advice. I spotted a Robin diesel on e bay just down the road in Bognor Regis but after making enquiries found out it's a 30DY. I'm assuming it is less powerful than a 41DY (looked like a 41DY in the photos).
I spoke to a very nice guy from Mawsley Machinery today who dealt with the Robin engines for Enfield's back in the 90's. Their ex MD (now retired) still has a diesel Enfield and knew Ernie Dorsett well.
I have been told to talk to a guy called Wayne Marlow who carried out the conversions to the Robin Engines for RB Developments but he has left the industry and I have no current contact details.
I belong to the Lotus 7 club as I have owned a Caterham 7 for over 10 years. I have always been impressed how helpful they are but you guys are just as friendly. Amazing what friendships can be formed from a common interest!
Meanwhile, I'll keep looking. After all, it's only been a week!

Brucey

[gilburton]

You might get this cheaper if you stop them renovating it? And it's down your way although it's a DY41??
Might be worth making contact for the future though???
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Robin-RGD5000 ... 27d8d077bc

[brucey]

Gilburton, thanks for the information.

Blimey, that's a coincidence, my parents are good friends with the MD's parents! Also they are located about 10 miles from my house!

If it was a DY42 electric start, I'd probably buy it and resell the Generator but it isn't.

It's nice to know the engines are still coming up. I'm pretty optimistic I'll be able to get a couple of DY 42's sooner or later.

I notice from the parts manual that the electric start models have different crankcases which could complicate things.

brucey

[gilburton]

Well make it known to them you're looking for one
Apart from that Wheeled Horse mowers and Belle floor saws used them and I'm sure lots of other garden machinery!
The DY41 is physically the same as the DY42 so if you could get a cheap or scrap one it could serve as spares?
It would also allow you to get on with converting an Enfield and could be used until you find a DY42.
I've never really found out what the actual differences are? Apart from the very slight increase in cc and as most parts seem to be the same I came to the conclusion it must be in the cyl. head eg better flow or something?
I'm sure you are aware the DY41 was originally used by Ernie and other converters?
It could be the crankcases are different because they are not drilled out for the starter?? Anyway it would be much better to get an electric start one in the first place.

[peterpodd]

Cheers Pietenpol2002,
He was very impressed with the publicity info I was given on the 'Yellow Peril' which was unfortunately destroyed in a fire at the National Motorcycle Museum. Maybe I should build a replica with the bits I have? Does anyone have any good quality photos of this bike?

brucey

Hi Brucey

If it's still of interest, I rode Yellow Peril on both its round-Britain economy runs, the first successful and the second (around 1998) which was abandoned for various reasons! I could probably dig out a picture from somewhere if you still need one. Would be nice to see a replica built. I still own the second Enfield Robin, built by Ernie, which I ran as a long-term test for Diesel Car then bought when I left the magazine.

all best

Peter Henshaw

[brucey]

Peter,

Nice to hear from you.

I attended the Big Knock Rally a couple of weeks ago (I felt slightly out of place in my Caterham 7!) but had a great time. Everyone was really friendly and enthusiastic. I spoke to a couple of Robin Matchless owners and had a look at their bikes. This has reinspired me to start my build!

I have purchased a couple of second hand DY42 engines and a 2005 Enfield Bullet Trials so am ready to start.

Any photos or information on the Yellow Peril would be gratefully recieved.

I'm also struggling a bit with details on the flywheel mods, especially if, how and where it was lightened.
I believe the alternator was upgraded to 180w to run the lighting but am not sure who did this.

I have started a number of threads on this forum and the information I have received has been priceless. What a great bunch of people.

Best Regards,

Bruce.