Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

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mr chips
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Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by mr chips » Wed May 27, 2009 9:57 am

Hi all,
I have a trike with a 1.5 diesel engine out of a Peugeot 106 mounted onto the chassis & gearbox from a VW Beetle. A mate of mine is doing some work for me including new SIPS etc, but also including fitting a new-to-me engine - a 1.8 XUDT out of a 306. With an intercooler, that would take my power up from 58 hp to 90 hp, and even without it I'd still be jumping up to 76 hp while only placing an additional 11kg on the back. This will be great for when I go on my triking holiday in Scotland in July.

Sounds great, yeah? Well, we've come up against a couple of big snags and it's head-scratching time. The 1.5 was mounted onto the gearbox using a mounting plate, which I expected to have to modify or replace for the new engine. However the flywheel of the 1.8 is about 20mm wider than that of the 1.5, and it doesn't have enough clearance inside the bellhousing of the gearbox itself - you could probably just about fit it in and no more. Using a mounting plate to effectively locate the flywheel outside the gearbox means that the spigot shaft might still be long enough to engage the clutch plate, but not to engage the driveshaft of the engine.

At the minute, the easiest solution would be if the flywheel could be replaced by a smaller one - however the one from the old engine won't fit. Can anybody suggest a flywheel from a different engine that might suit?

Another option could be a replacement spigot shaft for the existing gearbox, or a similar gearbox (Porsche?) with a longer spigot shaft. I don't know whether it's possible to get a longer spigot shaft for the VW gearbox, or whether a Porsche box would have a longer spigot shaft - about 20mm. However changing/modifying the gearbox is likely to be a lot more expensive and/or time-consuming, and I need to have this job finished by the end of June.

A third option could even be to get the holes in the flywheel from my old engine filled in and then re-drilled to fit it into the new engine. Again, time and cost are against me here.

So - if anybody can think of any other solutions, especially a low-cost/quick solution, I would really, really like to hear from you!!

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
Vroom, vroom - mmm, doughnuts ...

Nanko
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by Nanko » Wed May 27, 2009 4:46 pm

mr chips wrote: A third option could even be to get the holes in the flywheel from my old engine filled in and then re-drilled to fit it into the new engine. Again, time and cost are against me here.
This is probably the easiest option ,also no need to reposition the starter motor

I just checked the dimensions of the 1.6 and 1,9 petrol engines , but they are the
same as the diesels.

Not just the holes for the bolts have to be rebored , also the center hole.
when the centerhole is machined at the same diameter the flywheelscan be lined
up with a machined piece of aluminium , now use the XU fly wheel as a template
to drill or file the 8 boltholes in the TUD wheel.
I dont think its nessecary to fill up the existing holes.
This worked well when I had to modify the moto guzzi flywheel

The XUD7T Thas more torque , but the max engine rpm is 4600 , ( 5500 for the TUD5 )
Depending on the gearing , your topspeed can drop.
peugeot TUD5 - MOTO GUZZI 16.500 km so far

mr chips
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by mr chips » Tue Aug 25, 2009 8:26 am

Just a bit of an update on this - my mate had a Beetle flywheel lying around, so I'm back on the road for the summer (ha!) with just the 1.5XUD for now, and the Beetle flywheel is being adapted for the 1.8 engine. We'll try fitting it once the last chances of some decent weather have definitely passed!

I was wondering about the top speed and whether it might drop. Just have to wait & see, I guess ... with the 1.5, I seem to hit a flat spot at just the wrong point for overtaking at motorway speeds. Not really worried if I can't go faster than 85-90 mph, (current top speed is 85 in fourth with a tail wind) but would like to get there reasonably quickly!
Vroom, vroom - mmm, doughnuts ...

tappy
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by tappy » Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:37 pm

The alternative would be to have the new (larger diameter) flywheel turned down and a new ring of gear teeth shrunk onto it for the starter motor.

mr chips
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by mr chips » Sat May 29, 2010 7:52 pm

Just another update on this - the engine fitted is the 90bhp, 1767cc XUDT with intercooler. Its flywheel was reduced to fit within the Beetle bellhousing. She will certainly reach 90mph without any flat spots and with much-improved "twist and go" acceleration in top gear. Only a few minor items to finish off now and I should be back on the road proper.
Vroom, vroom - mmm, doughnuts ...

mr chips
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by mr chips » Sat May 29, 2010 10:55 pm

Couple of pics ... no seats yet!
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Vroom, vroom - mmm, doughnuts ...

Sphere
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by Sphere » Sun May 30, 2010 9:22 am

Oh my :) That's ferocious :mrgreen:
'92 Enfield + Hatz 1B40: street legal, weld up stainless exhaust, check engine rpm and change final drive sprocket.

IgorVigor
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by IgorVigor » Sun May 30, 2010 4:37 pm

Tune the engine, and you will get a lot more power...

its fairly cheap to get a noticeable improvement out of it...

up the fueling (both pre and boost fueling), adjust the wastegate for more boost psi, and you will probably get another 20~30hp from the engine...

I dont know which fuel pump it will have on it (bosch or lucas/CAV)...

good engines from what I have heard...

looking good though so far :)

mr chips
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Re: Mounting a different engine - help please, a bit urgent!

Post by mr chips » Fri Jun 25, 2010 9:05 am

Right, a little update on this. The new seats have been added, but I've had a fair few niggles over the past few weeks, which of course was really just a running-in period after the rebuild - still, I didn't expect so many things to happen in such a short space of time. Read on, if you dare!

First of all, a jubilee clip on a section of the coolant return hose just underneath the frame was either knocked loose or hadn't been sufficiently tightened, which meant that as I was heading down the road after my very first test run, the hose connection came apart and I lost all coolant in under a minute. Fortunately a kind motorist flashed me to a stop as soon as this happened and I managed to get it sorted before blowing the engine up!

Then a wiring issue (which we initially thought was related to the fuel gauge but turned out to be the new digital speedo) left me stranded with a dead battery for a while. That's been sorted, but the fuel gauge still won't register more than a quarter full, even after putting 26 litres in.

What next? Ah yes - my throttle cable broke, not once but twice, the second time causing the twist-grip to jam and leaving me with a gouged throttle housing that fouls the twisting action of the grip - not an item you tend to find easily on ebay etc, which meant I've had to replace one of the few remaining Harley parts on my trike - £70 and you don't even get the switches ...

I had a recurring problem with one of the mudguards (which were both due to be replaced anyway) - for some reason the left one kept working loose, in spite of the bracket being attached with locking nuts, washers and loctite. The last time this happened, I spotted it wobbling in my mirror, and thought "Uh-oh, need to pull over and re-tighten that" - only for one of the bolts to fall out just at that very moment, literally as I was looking for a safe place to stop. Consequently the bracket touched against the tyre sidewall and the whole mudguard was flung forward, pivoting around the remaining fixing bolt and jamming in between the front of the left tyre and the trike frame. This acted as a sudden brake on one side only, causing me to swerve to a stop. Fortunately I was only doing 25 mph ...

Then about ten miles after I got going again from that little incident, I had another heart-stopping moment when my rear brakes failed! I lost the shaft that goes from the lower part of the brake lever to the master cylinder - this was a genuinely frightening experience. I'm pretty sure I know what caused something so unusual as that to happen, and it's nothing to do with me or the friend who's been doing the rebuild work, but anyway, I managed to stop and no harm was done, so I won't say anything here. Since then, the new lightweight fibreglass mudguards have been fitted, and the brackets spot-welded in place to ensure this problem does not recur!! And the brake shaft has of course been replaced.

Still wasn't out of the woods yet, though - I brought the trike for its first "official" outing last weekend, and just as I arrived at the destination, coolant started gushing out of the back! Was very worried about that, as it was coming from higher up the engine which could have meant a cracked head, but once we'd gotten the bodyshell off (a two-person job) it turned out that one of the coolant hoses had developed a split due to having rubbed against a bracket for some years. A length of replacement hose, cable-tied in position to prevent the same happening again, together with about a litre and a half of water to top up the lost coolant, and I was able to ride home again.

Phew!! Although there's been a fair bit of frustration and a little anxiety thrown in for good measure, no harm has been done to me or the trike so I'm happy out. Such an extensive rebuild is bound to entail a few teething problems, so hopefully that's the worst of them behind me. Today I'm going to pick up parts for an upgrade to the rear brakes - swapping in front slave cylinders for the rear ones (more effective on the Beetle drum brakes), plus I'm getting a new bigger brake master cylinder. I've also ordered a remote servo off ebay. I looked into upgrading the brakes from drums to disks but it was going to cost around £500, whereas the options I've gone for should do the job for me at a cost of £150.

Once that's done, all that's left is to fit the new stainless steel luggage rack (already being constructed as I write) and the new exhaust to replace the rusty old bit of scaffolding that currently does the job. Then in a couple of weeks' time, it's Scotland here I come!
Vroom, vroom - mmm, doughnuts ...

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